Feb

We Must Wake Up

Posted by: Sonny in Application, Body of Christ, Church of God, Doctrine, Spiritual Warfare

Divide and conquer. I am sure you have heard the term. It is a term for a tactic that is used to defeat an enemy. The concept is that if you can successfully cause a group of enemies to turn on each other it is easy to sweep in and conquer them. It is the oldest battle tactic of all. The enemy used it in the beginning to divide the created from the creator and it has been used ever since. And very successfully.

One aspect of using this tactic successfully is to deceive your enemy in a way that they do not always see the division. Until it is too late. Our adversary has continued to use this tactic since that first epic division with great results. There are many that have entered into an eternity without God because of it.

I am following a lot of discussions and situations in the body of Christ that are causing dissension, distrust, confusion, and anger between the participants. It seems most are not even aware or concerned with the harm that is being done or how the arguments over things that are either not essential to the mission or just blatantly wrong are helping to divide us. When I try to determine essentials as it concerns the Gospel I actually see it as rather simple.

Joh 3:16 “For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life.

Mat 22:37-40 And he said to him, “You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind. This is the great and first commandment. And a second is like it: You shall love your neighbor as yourself. On these two commandments depend all the Law and the Prophets.”

Mat 28:19 Go therefore and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit,

These three things are the essentials. These three are all we really need to know to stay on mission. The rest of the bible can be seen as instruction on understanding and learning to apply these three.

God loved us so much He was willing to become one of us in the person of Jesus so He could rescue us from the clutches of the enemy that we had allowed to enslave us, then He instructs us to love Him and each other, and finally to go and tell all about this great love of His and to show them how to spread it also. So the real essential is the mission of spreading love. And nothing else.

I see more dissension being sown than love being spread as I look at the body of Christ. One of my main objections to God even existing for most of my life was that I saw very little love, hardly any sacrifice, and only token agreement within Christianity. This is a historical and a present reality even now. I am a part of the body now and still see the same things.

Luther, Calvin, Arminius; no agreement there. Spurgeon, Moody, Wesley, Finney; no agreement there. Piper, Wright, Pinnock, Conn, Spong; no agreement there. Baptist, Episcopalian, Catholic, Pentecostal; no agreement there. COG member and another COG member; no agreement there. Not only is this sad, not only is this divisive, this is dangerous. Hatred is being spread, intolerance is being observed and souls are being lost. The mission is not being done because we are too busy telling the other how wrong they are. We must wake up to the tactics of enemy that is walking among us.

The arguments and the view of essentials in my own denomination and even my own church are very disconcerting to me. Tongues as initial evidence, alcohol consumption, missional or Pentecostal, and a misplacement of love are just a few areas where lines are being drawn and the enemy sits back laughing while watching us pound on each other. I am sorry but I can’t even find the scripture where Jesus spoke in tongues, I can show you where He drank wine, His focus was wholly missional and relational, and He point blank told us who to love. Take notice where our love is supposed to be applied. It is to persons and not things.

Instead I am reading declarations of steadfast love for a denomination while those same advance no attitudes of love or outreach for the ones outside the Kingdom. In fact, some of the things they are arguing against in their unyielding traditional, denominational defenses cause those we should be reaching from even giving us a chance to spread the love we are supposed to be spreading.

The Church of God is an institution, an organization, a denomination; and I do not love it. I love the people in it. I also love the people in the Assemblies of God, the Baptists, the Methodists, the Catholics, the Muslims, the Hindus, and the list goes on and on to include even the agnostics and atheists.

We have people that won’t accept anything but the style of preacher that they want, the music that they want to hear, the order and method of service they grew up with, and even the times the services must be done. When are we going to wake up to the machinations of our enemy? When are we going to realize the necessity of unity even if it means sacrifice? When are we going to discern our own self-centeredness? When are we going to apply our misplaced love appropriately?

If the lost in my community want to sing reggae, country spirituals and this will keep them in church long enough to become disciples, then shouldn’t we be willing to throw out the hymnals and praise choruses? If the lost in my community want to sit on couches with the lights turned down a notch and have a spiritual discussion instead of a pulpit pounding, corn shucking, belt jerking, spittle spewing preacher yelling at them, then shouldn’t we be willing to give it a try?

Mat 28:19 Go therefore to church, sit on the pews, sing only what you like, keep a pastor and stand behind him only if he preaches to you and only if he does it the way you want him to, and do not in any way suffer the person that does not agree with you, in the name of (insert your own name). (Self-centered interpretation)

This is how we read this commandment today for the most part. Isn’t it time we went to war, got back on mission, and at least tried to do what Jesus said? It will take sacrifice. But He sacrificed Himself so you could sit there on that pew and be wrong.

What if that lost person that won’t come to church because of your self-centered requirements is your grandchild? Will you sacrifice then?

I love you all (and hope you can still love me)

Tags: atheist, Body of Christ, Calvin, catholics, Christianity, Church, Church of God, Creator, dissension, Enemy, eternal life, Eternity, Holy Spirit, Love, muslim, Pentecost, piper, Self

This entry was posted on Sunday, February 22nd, 2009 at 7:41 pm and is filed under Application, Body of Christ, Church of God, Doctrine, Spiritual Warfare. You can follow any responses to this entry through the RSS 2.0 feed. You can leave a response, or trackback from your own site.

14 comments so far

Justin A

Sonny,

You covered a lot of territory. I think your main thrust is that we are not doing enough to make disciples. Probably most would agree.

You listed some basic core beliefs that are essential. Probably most would agree with that also. Differences come when you start discussing other beliefs that are important but are not necessarily essentials. There are also differences that have to do with the essentials but are not explicitly essential.

You said that disagreement is sad, divisive, and dangerous. I assume that you yourself disagree with some people so I am not sure what you meant by that statement.

I would say that there is truth and there is error. Our job is to pursue the truth. Truth will, of course, disagree with error. Some of the people you listed promote some serious error. I have heard you say that you believe they are in error and you disagree with them. I think that what is sad, divisive and dangerous is promoting error and it is our responsibility to promote truth over error. It is our responsibility to disagree with error. I think one of the things the enemy rejoices over is when we accept error as truth.

Concerning divisiveness, is it divisive to hold a belief or is it divisive to disagree with a belief that someone else holds?

For example, the Church of God believes that after salvation it is possible and beneficial to get closer to God. The Bible teaches that new Christians need to progress from milk to meat. Two important steps after salvation are sanctification and baptism with the Spirit. The church teaches that those steps are important but the church does not teach that they are necessary to get to heaven. The church believes that the true baptism with the Spirit is accompanied by tongues as the initial evidence due to Biblical reasons. In the New Testament, everyone who is recorded as receiving the Holy Ghost baptism either is directly quoted as speaking in tongues or it is implied that they spoke in tongues. You mentioned that Jesus is not recorded as speaking in tongues. I suppose you were kidding since you know that speaking in tongues was the evidence that the Holy Ghost had been sent after Jesus returned to the Father.

Is it divisive to hold the belief that speaking in tongues is the initial evidence or is it divisive to believe otherwise? The Church of God denomination has a method in place to make orderly changes to teachings. If most people agree that a teaching needs to be changed it can be changed. This has happened many times in the past. Believing or not believing that speaking in tongues is the initial evidence of the Holy Ghost baptism is not divisive. Stirring up dissension is divisive. The manner of disagreement is what is important.

You listed several institutions that consist of people whom you love. And rightly so. Some of the institutions have teachings which, if believed and adhered to, will guarantee that the people who believe them will go to hell. I assume you would tell those people that you disagree with the teachings of their institution and that they should accept your belief so they could go to heaven.

A denomination is a group of people who have common beliefs. Some beliefs are essential. Some are important but not essential. It is necessary for a denomination to develop rules to go by which are not found in the Bible. To take an extreme example, a rule forbidding unrepentant prostitutes from teaching a Sunday School class would be not a direct quote from the Bible but would be an acceptable rule. (I hope it would be an unnecessary rule.)

Concerning music. My personal preference is for the songs to proclaim the truth. One of my goals for a music style for church worship is that the music should not be offensive. For example, very loud is liked by some but offensive to some so I would rule out the very loud. There are many styles that fit the non-offensive category. I think variety is a good thing within reason. The original purpose of some of the hymns we sing today is to put scriptural truth to music for educational purposes. If you throw away the hymns and choruses and replace them with country spirituals to appeal to sinners in the community what if most sinners in the community do not like country spirituals. You just turned away the people you said you wanted to reach. By the way, you mentioned reggae and I wasn’t sure what it was so I looked it up. Based on the history I’m not sure I would pick that style as our main center of worship.

Reggae
Reggae is a music genre developed in Jamaica in the late 1960s.The term ‘reggae’ is sometimes used in a broad sense to refer to most types of Jamaican music, although the word specifically indicates a particular music style that originated after the development of ska and rocksteady. Reggae is based on a rhythm style characterized by regular chops on the off-beat, known as the skank. The tempo is generally slower than that found in ska and rocksteady. Reggae is often associated with the Rastafari movement.

Rastafari movement
Rasta, or the Rastafari movement, is a cultural value system that accepts Haile Selassie I, the former Emperor of Ethiopia, as God incarnate, whom they call Jah. He is also seen as part of the Holy Trinity as the messiah promised in the Bible to return. The name Rastafari comes from Ras (literally “Head,” an Ethiopian title equivalent to Duke), and Tafari Makonnen, the pre-coronation name of Haile Selassie I.

I think our goal is to pursue fellowship with other Christians, reach and disciple the lost, and show love to Christians and sinners with our actions and deeds and pursue the truth. There will be disagreements. To show love we should disagree agreeably.

February 23rd, 2009 at 7:34 am

Sonny

Thank you for the dissection, critique, and literal explanation of all I said. As usual you have actually made me come to an even firmer stance in what I think. I am not ever going to write something that is perfect in presenting my case but I do know what I am saying and thinking.

Your points, when looked at individually, at times are also the way I believe. You say you stand for truth and that is what is the most important thing of all and to hell with those who do not accept your view of truth while I say I stand for truth but that the most important thing is to reach the lost and bring them in and keep them long enough for me to reach them with that truth and to hopefully keep them out of hell. I am also humble enough to actually admit that I might not see the truth of an issue yet.

You want every thing and everyone to be as literal as you are and maybe be an expert at all things or shut up. Example would be the reggae issue above or the squirrel issue in the Shack. While I can and do grab something that obviously is not literal to make a point.

There are “truths” I am coming to believe that may even cause me to have to leave the COG. I hate this but if I am going to be a man, and especially a teacher, I have to have integrity. I am tired of keeping my mouth shut because of some peoples, that I respect and love, views of some things.

There is very little love for the lost in the chuirch. Not just our church but all churches, all denominations. There is a lot of lip service though. If you can not see this then I don’t know how to present it.

Love you

February 23rd, 2009 at 10:44 am

Christie

Sonny, what are you looking for? I don’t want an answer, it just seems that you are so frustrated and angry. This is God’s church and when he wants change, it will come. Many people have came to this church and had their lives changed, why is not good enough now?

February 23rd, 2009 at 11:43 am

Sonny

I am looking for those willing to do what Christ said to do. I am looking for those whose attitudes are more about going than sitting. Reaching out than focusing inward. About sacrificial love instead of self centered satisfaction. What are you looking for?

I am frustrated but not angry. Individually I see some good and know some loving people but if anyone thinks we are spreading the love that Christ wants us to spread then they need to wake up.

This whole concept of church and denomination and doctrine, while necessary for equipping the saints, has gone no further. While we sit around argueing the finer points of what songs to sing and whether this is that and that is this, we are dying. Churches are closing at a phenomenal rate but we are maintaining so lets just close our eyes.

If you want to see me as angry then okay. But I am using what little voice I have to try to wake us up to why we are going to lose our grandchildren.

Sorry if that offends. I challenge all to look outside your own circle and see what is happening around the nation.

Maybe I am angry. I have lots of grandchildren.

February 23rd, 2009 at 12:14 pm

Sonny

If you think I am angry because of my comments to Justin instead of the post then that is wrong. Justin and I just speak a little boldly and bluntly with each other most of the time. I am not angry with him and he is not angry with me, I don’t think.

February 23rd, 2009 at 12:28 pm

Justin A

Sonny, You wrote:
“You say you stand for truth and that is what is the most important thing of all and to hell with those who do not accept your view of truth”
That is not what I said. It is not what I meant. I don’t talk that way and I don’t think that way. How did you get that idea from what I wrote?

You wrote:
“I stand for truth but that the most important thing is to reach the lost and bring them in and keep them long enough for me to reach them with that truth…”
I also think the most important thing is to reach the lost. I don’t think reaching the lost and truth are mutually exclusive.

You wrote:
“You want every thing and everyone to be as literal as you are and maybe be an expert at all things or shut up”
How did you get the idea that I think anyone should shut up? I thought we were discussing an issue. I welcome a response as always.

You wrote:
“I am also humble enough to actually admit that I might not see the truth of an issue yet.”
Thank you for giving me hope. I will keep working on it.

The reggae issue was, I thought, an interesting bit of trivia. I didn’t think you were suggesting we convert to reggae. I’m not backing down on the squirrel issue, though. I think that is important.
As I wrote in my original response, I agree we need to do more to reach the lost. I am looking forward to our new pastor and I am interested in giving him a chance. Hopefully everyone will retain their interest and we can go forward.

February 23rd, 2009 at 1:17 pm

Sonny

And you wrote

“You wrote:
“I am also humble enough to actually admit that I might not see the truth of an issue yet.”
Thank you for giving me hope. I will keep working on it.”

I suspect this is true even if I did use some strong language to get my point across. I also will keep working on it.

A appreciate our discourse and probably should not try to come across quite so strongly. I do forget myself that more than just you and I are reading this.

Thanks Justin and I hope you realize nothing in my comments are to personally offend. I feel strongly about things as you do. You might be right, I might be right, or we might both be wrong. But one truth is definitive, we are not both right.

Love you all

February 23rd, 2009 at 1:30 pm

Sonny

“You say you stand for truth and that is what is the most important thing of all and to hell with those who do not accept your view of truth”

This does sound more personally aimed at you Justin than I intended. It was meant as a representative statement about a lot of people that I do not think are even aware of what some of their stances are doing to keep the unchurched out of the church.

February 23rd, 2009 at 3:27 pm

Mike Ward

Sonny,

You don’t know me, but I am a friend of Shannon & Dee who lives in Cleveland Tennessee. I have visited your blog site on several occasions and I have got to say it is quite impressive– both visually and more importantly in terms of its content. When I read your blog entitled “We must wake up,” I realized that you and I share some common views as it pertains to the church and its purpose in the world.
In 1975 I surrendered my life to Christ and immediately realized that I would need to leave behind the only religious affiliation I had ever known–Catholicism. When I came into the Church of God, I guess you could say, I felt like I had “arrived” at some spiritual promised land. The church I attended was a very loving and caring group of people. I had never experienced such intimacy and support in the Catholic church which I had attended from the time I was born until age twenty.
I wish that I could say that is how the story ends, but I simply can not. So as to not bore you with all the details let me say that after a period of time I began to realize that I was not living in God’s Camelot, but rather I was sharing an existence with brothers and sisters who had weaknesses and flaws (spiritual warts). Then, worst of all, God felt it necessary to make me look in the mirror of His Word and there I found out I wasn’t as “good looking” as I thought. It turns out, that the look in Gods mirror was absolutely the best thing that could have happened to me.You see, when I began to discern the things which I felt were contrary to the Will of God in the lives of others (including leaders in the Church of God), I quickly became disillusioned with the church. Which eventually led to severe spiritual frustration, and when I could not reconcile what I was seeing in the church with God’s Word, it eventually caused me to question the validity of my own salvation experience. Afterall if they weren’t exactly what they were suppose to be then maybe I wasn’t either. You might be asking yourself right now, exactly how was this the best thing that could have happened to me?
It was at this point of convergence (their warts and mine) that God was able to make me realize the depth of His grace and mercy. It is woven throughout scripture and throughout the history of His dealings with humanity–He is so patient and longsuffering towards us! It was demonstrated in the life of a person like Abraham who tried to make happen himself (Ishmael) what only God can and should bring about (Isaac); and in David,who surrendered his moral integrity to the lust for Bathsheba and yet God spared his life and his kingship; and also in the failure of a man called Peter, who in a moment of great doubt and fear, surrendered his devotion to Christ for the purpose of self-preservation.Yet each of these individuals experienced the restorative power of Gods grace, mercy, patience and longsuffering.By showing me the extent of my own failures, as well as the significantly greater extent of His grace and mercy towards me, God taught me to be more patient and longsuffering toward others–particularly toward those in leadership positions who were often targets of my consternation and ridicule (even if it was intended to be of a “constructive” nature),as well as targets of the one (Satan) who desires to destroy their influence .
Lest anyone think that I feel that I have arrived at a place of great spiritual inner harmony, let me assure I still struggle with times of great distress and frustration about where the church is headed. However, it is then that God reminds me of this lesson taught,if not yet fully learned. Then I find myself enabled again to seek Gods forgiveness for my judgemental determinations, whether right or wrong. In turn, I am able to pray for those over me in the Lord and for those in my local fellowship who’s warts might be painfully evident.

To be honest with you Sonny, I became distressed in my spirit when I read your statement that you “might have to leave the Church of God.” Distressed, not because there would be one less head to count on the COG membership roll, but simply because there would be one less prophetic voice in the church crying out to God for His hand of mercy and grace to be extended to us.
Moses is considered to be the greatest of the prophets,and while he did spend some time condemning the actions of a “stiffnecked” people, the greatest display of his love and passion was seen in his times of powerful intercession before God on behalf of those stiffnecked people. When Moses stood before God and asked Him to take his own life if God was going to destroy Israel (and he sincerely meant it-he wasn’t pulling the greatest bluff in history), I believe it was one of the greatest examples of a Christ-like life ever displayed by a mere human being. We need all the Moses’ that God has gifted the church with, to be crying out to God in behalf of the church.

Change will not come by leaving the church, (which I at one time intended to do) but by remaining within the confines that God has placed us. When the children of Israel came to the river Jordan, but refused to believe God and cross over into the Promised Land Moses, Joshua and Caleb would have been justified to say “We are out of here”. However, they knew that the promises of God were given to all of His people and their directive from God was to lead the people. So, instead they chose to stay with and lead a stubborn and unbelieving people as they wandered in the wilderness for 40 years. As imperfect and downright frustrating that the church can often times be, it is the vessel God has chosen to demonstrate His grace and mercy through. Do we fall short? Yes. Is there a need for the church to grow up? Absolutely. Will we get it all together in this life? Not likely. However, it is of utmost importance that we faithfully and with Christ-like love and compassion fulfill our role within the body of Christ–as imperfect as it is.

I have said all of this to say I hope that you will continue to cry out to God in behalf of His people there at Alabaster, and that you not become discouraged or “weary in your well-doing.”

Your brother in Christ,
Mike

p.s. since you don’t know me I want to assure you that I welcome your being honest and candid in your response to my post–should you choose to respond.

February 24th, 2009 at 1:40 am

Sonny

Thank you so much Mike.

Ever since I read the first response this morning I have been upset. This whole blog post has been sitting here waiting to be posted or not be posted since last Thursday. I know that I have been a little negative lately but as one who actually was held back for years because of the hypocrisy and unloving attitudes of those Christians I watched, I am getting really frustrated that I still see it. I know we are not perfect and some of these same questions I ask others you can be assured I ask myself.

I also found a group of people that loved me when I joined the COG at Alabaster. But I have to admit that I don’t see it for everyone. I looked right. I was clean, had a job and wore a suit every Sunday. And most of all, they did not have to come get me, I came to them.

I want to see a church that is so hungry to reach out and bring others into the Kingdom that they are willing to sacrifice something. But sometimes it seems that I see no one really willing to sacrifice anything.

Don’t get me wrong, I love the people at Alabaster. I love all the people that comment here. I know that sometimes it might not read that way but I do. Nothing I write on here is directed at any individual, it is directed across the board and not even just at COG folks.

The thought of leaving the COG is heavy on me and has been for a while. It is not because of anyone else but because of my own convictions. I got saved seven years ago and as a babe in Christ I joined. I did not fully comprehend a certain doctrinal commitment the way it is written with which I now cannot in good conscience believe. It actually comes down to a word that points to a conclusion that I do not find in the bible. I have been wrestling with this for three years and do not know if I can keep on. I feel like I am lying. I am not just ready to throw it away. That statement about leaving is wholly because of my own convictions.

I know we are not perfect. I am far from it. But I am driven in my desire to reach out in love to others instead of what we seem to mostly be doing. I try my best to reach out to those I know in love while at the same time trying to be vocal about where we are going wrong. I am praying for all of us, you can be sure. I have six kids and none of them are serving Christ. It is mostly my fault but it is also their own and even partly an unyielding church.

I don’t want to just keep on and on but yes, I am frustrated. With myself first, then my church, then my denomination and finally the body of Christ. Thanks again for your visits here, your post and your concern. And please comment some more.

Love you

February 24th, 2009 at 2:17 am

Bro L

Acting a little high and mighty here. Why do you think you know more than we do? some of us have been saved and sanctified and had the holy ghost a lot longer than you. i have heard you teach and you seem to think you know it all and we no nothing. I am praying for you. Do you have the holy ghost. that might be your problem.

February 24th, 2009 at 6:23 am

Nancy Massey

Sonny,

I love you and Tammy very much and I think I understand how you feel. I have seen people come and go and I jave seen how some are treated. I have heard my own children talk about how someone said something to them that was actually none of their business or out of line. I don’t know if we think that because we are in a church building we have the right to say and or do anything we feel lead to do (some are lead by self more often than the Holy Spirit). I myself have had comments directed to me from individuals that if I wanted I could have taken offense and maybe even left the church. I tell my kids and myself, we do not attend a perfect church. The church we attend is a huge part of our life (mine especially). We go to assemble together with like believers-even though some react with more passion. Jesus was filled with passion. Passion for the lost, passion for the Word of God, passion against highmindedness. He truely showed love. He was eager to teach and reach out to the unloveable. He did not tollerate injustice. He was meek and understandable. He did not have a problem getting his message across. It is too easy to let our own personality bleed over into the message we bring however God knows this. Your passion somethimes comes across as anger and those who know you can filter it through our relationship with you.

February 24th, 2009 at 10:42 am

Sonny

Thanks Nancy for your comments and sharing. Some of these attitudes are exactly what I am talking about.

Bro L,

It seems we may go the same church. Your response does not surprise me either. Please come talk to me in person. I am not who you evidently think I am.

Love you all

February 24th, 2009 at 10:58 am

Nancy Massey

I love the people at our church. I feel that church is like family as a matter of fact I have more in common with my church family than most of my natural family. I believe Sonny mentioned that once in class. Why is it that we will accept the little quirks and differences in our natural family and love them anyway but when it comes to our church family (or even visitors) we tend to put conditions on them? If we could only love as Christ loved-unconditionally-whole heartedly-without reservation. I have grandchildren also and I hope that they feel welcme at church, however church is not the only place that they can see the Lord. I am to show them Christ in all that I do (not just for them but for their parents and friends too). My own children attend other churches now and some of them don’t even go at all so how are they to see God if I don’t show Him through my actions? You build a wall one brick at a time. Careful to establish a good foundation. Having the right mixture of water and cement for your mortar. Some of us because of our past choices have built walls that are not sound. These walls are looming over us ready to fall on top of our head. The good news is that the Word of God is like a hammer it will break down the walls and in the rubble we can rise to see His perfect plan for our life. I cannot go back and retrain my children. I made alot of mistakes and I wish I could turn back time and do some things differently but I can’t. I can only give them to God knowing He is able to bring them into the fold. They do not always listen to me and evidently they do not listen very well to the teachers they have had but I am grateful for teachers that are not afraid to be bold and teach what God has given them and I am grateful for pastors that will preach the WHOLE WORD OF GOD RIGHTLY DIVIDING IT….as for thinking the COG is the only denomination going to heaven–I think not. I also think that agreeing to disagree on a nonsalvation issue is sometimes the best course of action. I thnk that there are lot’s of issues in the Bible that leave room for what I call wiggle room. If it is not going to keep me out of heaven then please don’t let you not being able to chang my mind about it keep you out either. None are perfect here and we all should find our happy place and work together to win the lost to Christ.

I hope and pray that our next pastor will not see us as spoiled rotten members, only here to get our way but as compassionate and loving-willing to do what is asked of us to further the work of God.

When was the last time you met with a group around the flag pole? Have you had lunch with your child this year in his or her school lunchroom? Do you bless your food-even when you go out to eat? Have you ministered to a person in need–hugs go a long way when a person is lonesome.

Be a blessing to someone today you may need one tomorrow :love U

Love you,

Nancy

February 24th, 2009 at 12:00 pm