This is my take on the situation that I brought up in the Town Hall discussion yesterday.  I had so much to say that it turned into a post instead of a comment.    If you just found this, go here to know what I am talking about. 

First, I am extremely happy with the response this week.  I am also happy that we have a diversity of thought displayed here also.  And this is what I want, your thoughts.  It is so easy to find what some famous preacher or theologian has to say on any given situation.  Google any topic and you can find various discussions ranging from legalistic to everything goes, from way out there to just plain ridiculous.  The internet has actually allowed us all to ‘borrow’ opinions instead of come up with our own. 

But I see some evidence of thought here today.

I held back details on purpose so we could get an idea about the general attitudes about a commercial enterprise in a church.  Whether the very idea would offend God, or not.  Not you or me, but God Himself.  If it doesn’t bother Him then it sure shouldn’t bother me. 

This is what the pastor of the church had to say about what he was doing…

Right now we are only open on weekends and Wednesday nights and special events at the church. However, we will soon be opening during the week as well.We staff the Starbucks ourselves with volunteers. Starbucks corporate sent trainers in and trained them and we are responsible for them knowing how to make all of the specialty drinks. They will be sending “mystery shoppers” (as they do to all of their locations) just to make sure we are making the product correctly.

All of the standard “house blend” coffee is free (sells for about $1.80 per cup in most starbucks). All of the other products will sell for about 15%-20% below what you might see at other Starbucks. All of the proceeds will go to youth and children’s ministries. In a sense, it’s just like a donut sale for Winterfest…just a bit more sophisticated
 
This pastor is Jerry Lawson of Daystar in Cullman, Alabama.  From what I gather, he took over this church in 1996 with pretty low attendance, which I can’t document.  But I do know that a few weeks ago they opened up their new facility with an attendance of close to 2000.  He has a Saturday evening, two Sunday morning, and a Sunday evening service.  And for those who know, this is Cullman we are talking about.  (I don’t mean anything negative here, just thinking about the population count.)
 

 

And I also hear that his people are workers.  They are doing something for the Kingdom up there.  And Brother Lawson must be doing something right. 

 

 

As for the objections; I, like Dee, first thought about the temple incident.  But I also see it as Jesus being upset about the manipulation of the faithful by imposing unfair exchange rates, thus profiting from the abuse of the righteous who only wanted to get closer to God.  See this post and think about what Jesus would do if He showed up at some of these ‘ministry’s’ today. 

And Chris’ thoughts are new to me; I will have to look up some on this idea about the sacrificial system being what Jesus was angry about.  I do believe God was unhappy with this system, even though he instituted it.  And He had a new program coming, that Christ knew about, that would abolish the need of the system.  But it is very interesting and I am glad to hear from you.  Keep studying and you should come back and comment some more.  I wish I could have did this ‘back when.’

Leigh brings up some valid thoughts about the distractions that I had not thought about.  Bathroom trips during services are something all churches have to deal with.  And as for those that are jittery and can’t wait for it to be over and this may sound harsh and unloving but, I say stay home.  What are they there for anyway?     Jesus wouldn’t need a Starbucks, but He would probably be hanging out in one, and not the one in church.

Sabrina brings up the idea of where does it all stop.  This is a valid observation.  We see a lot of churches that have abandoned the mission because they went too far.  But this is something we have to rely on our leaders to ascertain.  And if they do not use Godly judgment on these issues then we must bring it to their attention.   

And I am definitely in agreement with Connie about Jesus doing whatever it took.  You suggest nose piercing.  What about hands and feet?  Paul also talked about being all things to all people. 

Tammy talks about the opportunity for fellowship.  I can vouch for her and say that this has happened to and for her a number of times.  She means true fellowship, where a few meet and minister to each other, over coffee or whatever, and it turn into a meeting with the Holy Spirit.  He could show up in Starbucks to meet, comfort, guide, and instruct.  Who would keep Him out?

And I knew John would love the idea.

As for me, I am all for it.  As long as some boundaries are maintained.  And let me say that I don’t drink the stuff.  Coffee, that is.  Never have. 

If the concession closes during service, if it stays nonprofit and any proceeds are used for ministry or charity, if it increases fellowship, and brings some to church that otherwise wouldn’t come, then what is it about this that would bother God. 

Brother Lawson is offering some menu items free and all others at a reduced price.  And he is trying to get it open on weekdays. 

Just imagine that guy that comes every weekday morning to get his favorite concoction at a reduced price, and is continually served in Christlike love by that sold out to Jesus teen with the nose ring, and decides to come to a worship service and turns his life over in service to our King. 

If he is the only one that ever gets saved by doing this Starbucks thing, then those at Daystar have dealt a blow to the enemy camp.  As for me, that is what it is all about. 

Keep up the good fight, Pastor Jerry Lawson. 

Love you all 

 

 

 

 

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Here we are again.  It is time for the Tuesday Town Hall discussion again and hopefully we can have more discussion than we did last week.  This week I have a question that I don’t think is quite as divisive as last week and not nearly as important.  Or at least it may not be.  We’ll see. 

As for all of you who responded last week, thank you again.  We all have a lot of different backgrounds and beliefs and I think this is a good way to discuss them. 

Okay, let’s move to this week’s discussion.

There is a lot of discussion in the Body of Christ, the Church, on relevance and how we can reach and engage the people of our day’s culture.  Many churches are trying to do things differently while some are bemoaning the good old days.  Many different avenues are being explored.  I believe some are good, some okay, and some dangerous.  But I do agree we have to do something or I fear for the state of the Church when my grandchildren have to decide what to do about issues of faith. 

I will be touching on this again in the Combat Readiness series.  So here is the focus for today…

A church in my state, in my denomination, opened up a Starbucks in the lobby of their church this week. 

Without knowing anything more than this, what do you think about it?

Is it good?  Is it bad?  Is it biblically justified or condemned? 

What say you?

Love you all

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I was two years old when my parents divorced.  The man that I cannot call father didn’t care enough about me to stay around and I have never met him to this day.  My mother met another man, married him and he adopted me.  His name was Bill and he is who I call father. 

I hope this does not sound bitter because I am not and have never been.  The man who adopted me could not have loved me any more if he was my biological father.  I actually am grateful in a way that all of this worked out this way. 

Now I have been adopted by another Father.  My heavenly Father.  I am blessed more than some because I can truly say I have three fathers.  One did not really love me.  One loved me as much as man can.  And the last loves me more than any man can.  My Father, God, wants the best for me.  He wants me whole, and healthy.  He wants me fed and sheltered.  He wants me to rest in peace and to find joy in all things.  He wants me to prosper. 

In this ongoing series in which I am trying to develop a battle strategy against our adversary, I have presented some areas that I believe he is deceiving us.  This is the next one I will address.

A false gospel of the pursuit of happiness and wealth.  I just listed some things that I truly believe our Father wants for us all but as I said here, I believe the enemy has twisted and distorted Gods word and has either deceived or collaborates with many people who teach the so called ‘prosperity gospel’.  I think this is very dangerous weapon the enemy has unleashed.  This ‘gospel’ teaches that God wants us, above all else, to be happy, healthy, and prosperous. 

We are being taught that God is my father and as a ‘Kings Kid’ (Fred Price, Kenneth Copeland, and others) there is just no way He wants anything less than the best for us.  What does the Word of God say?

3Jn 1:2  Beloved, I pray that in all respects you may prosper and be in good health, just as your soul prospers.

These guys teach from this that God wants us to prosper financially.  Is that what is being said here?  When I read that short letter that John wrote I find that it seems to be about Gaius being commended for his walk, his ministry, and his love.  His soul was prospering and I believe John meant that he wanted him to prosper in his work and walk with God.

Joh 10:10  “The thief comes only to steal and kill and destroy; I came that they may have life, and have it abundantly.

They want us to believe that Jesus was telling us that we all should live in mansions and drive Rolls.  Is this the abundant life?  I thought life lived in joyous communion with God through the Holy Spirit was the abundant life. 

Luk 6:38  “Give, and it will be given to you. They will pour into your lap a good measure–pressed down, shaken together, and running over. For by your standard of measure it will be measured to you in return.”

This is the part of the lie that is the most dangerous and for anyone with any degree of discernment, it should be obvious.  Everyone of the leaders that claim that this verse teaches that giving money will get you more money in return, also tell you how much it will take and who is supposed to get your money.  And it is always them.  Not a missionary in your church.  Not a charity that feeds starving children.  No, you have to send them your $999.00, and you have to do it in the next twenty minutes or the windows of opportunity for this special blessing will be closed in heaven.  At least until next week. 

But did you notice that this verse is right in the middle of a lengthy discourse on true LOVE.  Love is what we are to give.  Love is what we are to sew.  Love is what will be poured back in our laps; pressed down, shaken together, and running over. 

Mar 10:30 but that he will receive a hundred times as much now in the present age

Here is where we get that hundredfold blessing.  Send in ten dollars and receive one thousand.  Wow.  God is so good.  But wait, is this really happening every time we give?  It doesn’t in my life.  God gives me back a hundred fold blessing all the time.  But it is not money very much at all.  Look at that verse again in context.

Mar 10:29-31  Jesus said, “Truly I say to you, there is no one who has left house or brothers or sisters or mother or father or children or farms, for My sake and for the gospel’s sake, but that he will receive a hundred times as much now in the present age, houses and brothers and sisters and mothers and children and farms, along with persecutions; and in the age to come, eternal life. “But many who are first will be last, and the last, first.”

Those that forsake all for Christ’s sake will be blessed a hundred fold with a lot of what they forsook.  Even persecutions.  Did you hear that from the televangelist? 

I could keep on and on.  Every scripture used to propagate this deceptive message can be proven to be taken out of context.  We are ‘Kings Kids’.  And God does want us to prosper.  But He wants us to prosper in the mission laid out for us.  And that is to advance the Kingdom by invading and overthrowing the enemy’s territory.  This false ‘gospel of prosperity’ is a major stronghold that we must take down.  We can only do this by rising up against this false teaching and exposing those who proclaim it for who they are. 

If we do not, someone is going to lose their standing as a ‘Kings Kid’.

Love you all

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18
Oct

Just Pray About It?

   Posted by: Sonny   in Love, Prayer, Responsibility, Sin, Spiritual Warfare

Tomorrow is the first of four special days that the General Overseer of my denomination has called to be set aside as special days of concerted prayer.  Starting at midnight and going till midnight there should not be a minute of any hour when there are no prayers being poured out to God on behalf of ourselves, our families, our churches, and our nation and world.  It should be an awesome time of communion with our Father.  I intend to pray as much as I can.  I have actually determined in my heart and mind that I will pray more tomorrow than I ever have. 

What is prayer to you? 

I could go on quite a bit on this but that is not the focus for now.  So for now, I will keep this simple.  I believe prayer to be, at the simplest level, communication with God.  A discussion with our Lord.  A talk with our Father. 

I actually heard an evangelist say once that this is not what prayer is.  He said prayer was asking and receiving from God.  I have to disagree with this.  If this was all prayer is, then how in the world are we supposed to pray without ceasing?  I want and need a lot of things but, I can’t even begin to come up with enough to continuously, never cease, to ask from God.  And if prayer is also receiving and we look to James 5:16 to see that righteous men’s prayers accomplish much, then why aren’t some receiving a whole lot?

Tuesday, in my first attempt to stimulate discussion, I posted and posited a scenario and some questions in hope of provoking thought on prayer, its effectiveness, and to ask if it was truly enough, in a given situation. 

I thank the three, only three, that responded with their comments.  They were good, loving responses to the situation I put forth.  But they didn’t get to the place I wanted to get to. 

I am one of the first ones that will say we have to love, and love, and love some more.  But I also believe, no, I know, that that love will look different depending on the person, the situation, and the circumstances. 

In that post, I asked the following questions.  What do you do?  How do you pray?  What do you ask for?  And do you think it would be effective?

The answers I got were great answers, and loving answers in a way, but the whole post was really designed to let me ask this question.

When is it time to stop letting people off the hook, so to speak, and tell them in no uncertain terms, that your praying for them in their current state, is probably a waste of time? 

Whew!  I got it out.  You will never know how hard it was for me to write that question. 

When I asked; what do you do; I knew that the vast majority say to simply pray.  Don’t confront, that has been done.  Don’t instruct, they already know.  Don’t judge, they need compassion. 

When I asked; how do you pray; I knew the vast majority of the faithful would say to pray for his salvation, his healing or comfort, and for God to be glorified.  I didn’t think anyone would pray for strength and instruction on how to disassemble the lies and deception our adversary had woven in this man’s life.

When I asked; what do you ask for; I knew the requests would mainly be in how to show love to the man, how to show compassion and how to love him.  I somehow knew that no one would ask God how to tell the guy that he is on his own if He doesn’t do a little more himself, like joining in the battle for his soul, than just relying on other warriors. 

Finally, when I asked if the prayers sent up would be effective; I somehow knew that most thought they would be.  I would have been very surprised if James 5:16 had not been brought up.  It was, by two out of the three commentators.  I even used it above.  It is a powerful verse but, we all have to admit that sometimes, no matter how fervent, no matter how much faith we have, what we ask for does not come about.  Sometimes people are not saved, sometimes people are not healed, and sometimes God is not glorified in a given situation. 

Jas 5:13-16  Is anyone among you suffering? Then he must pray. Is anyone cheerful? He is to sing praises. Is anyone among you sick? Then he must call for the elders of the church and they are to pray over him, anointing him with oil in the name of the Lord; and the prayer offered in faith will restore the one who is sick, and the Lord will raise him up, and if he has committed sins, they will be forgiven him. Therefore, confess your sins to one another, and pray for one another so that you may be healed. The effective prayer of a righteous man can accomplish much.

Who is James talking to?  He is talking to the brethren; those who walk in service to our King.  The man in my scenario was not described to be one of the brethren.  Just going to church does not mean you are fighting on the side of the Kingdom.  But you say, I am the one that is righteous and asked to do the praying.  Look at the part I emboldened.  It is the first part of James 5:16.  It is the part that no one bothers to memorize.  In my scenario the man never said he wanted to confess, or get forgiveness.  I purposefully implied that he only wanted healed.  Most of the people in church who don’t have nothing to do with you, the true prayer warriors, will quickly turn to you when they really, selfishly, need something.  But does that mean God will do what we ask?  Because of our service, and our faith?

It is time that we did a little bit more.  Prayer is our most effective weapon in the spiritual warfare we are involved in.  But we have to get it out of our head that it is to simply ask and receive.  In my scenario it is actually more about discussing the battle plan with our King. How do we let this man know that He can be healed, and forgiven, if he will only turn from his iniquity? 

 Isa 59:2  but your iniquities have made a separation between you and your God, and your sins have hidden His face from you so that He does not hear.

The man in my scenario, and many of those out there that ask for prayer, have caused God to hide His face from them because of their iniquity.  Some of my own children are in this group.  Do I stop praying for them?  No.  But do I let them know that that is probably not enough?  That they have a part to play in their own salvation?  Every chance I get. 

What is wrong with letting those that are on the wide path to destruction know that they bear the responsibilty for their choice?  As the people in the culture we live in accelerate ever faster towards their doom, isn’t it time we joined in the fight, to ram into them if need be, to knock them off the path to destruction? 

Sometimes, love hurts.

Love you all

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I am driving down the road in the middle of an older subdivision.  I see the stop sign coming up but can see that there is nothing at all coming or even a sign of life in sight.  I drive on through the intersection without stopping.  I break the law, intentionally. 

Have you ever done this?  Do you drive 75 mph on the interstate highway instead of the posted 70 mph?  Do you speed up at yellow lights or slow down?

There are laws in our society.  They serve dual purposes.  They serve to keep us or someone else from harm or they serve to stave off the chaos that could result from a lack of laws.  I am sure most of the readers here have never murdered someone.  I am also sure that most of the same readers have broken a law of society. 

Sometimes there are consequences such as fines or incarceration.  Sometimes we get away with breaking the law.  In fact, we actually get away with breaking the law most of the time. 

How does all of this compare with the laws of God?  Do you believe there are any laws of God? 

We know that God gave us the Ten Commandments.  Some of us know that God gave an exhausting list of laws to the Israelites while they were in the desert.  There are 613 recognized laws to be observed in the Torah.  This is known as the Mosaic Law.  From the study and implementation of these laws, the priesthood, by the time Jesus came on the scene, had developed the practice of following these laws into what I am calling pharisaical legalism. 

Pharisaical legalism.  This is an old tactic that the enemy still uses in our day and time.  I define this as; the forming of a set of rules and laws that man decides are necessary for righteousness.  These laws come from interpreting the bible with the help of the wrong spirits. This tactic is losing its effectiveness, I believe, in most religious settings today but, it is far from gone.  It was not that many years ago, in my own denomination, where a bunch of manmade interpretative laws were followed to assess the state of one’s soul.  Laws such as the length of hair and what jewelry, if any, could be worn by a servant of Christ would signify whether you were right with God or not.

Some will argue that some of the Mosaic Law is for Christians to follow, some for all, and some for none.  How are we to know?

Jesus said the following in the gospel of Matthew:

Mat 5:17  “Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them.

What does that mean?  Are we to follow the laws or not? 

The word interpreted as fulfill is pleroo in the original language and according to Thayer means the following, in part; to make full, to fill up, i.e. to fill to the full, to render full, i.e. to complete, to fill to the top: so that nothing shall be wanting to full measure, fill to the brim, to make complete in every particular, to render perfect,  to carry through to the end, to accomplish, carry out, (some undertaking), to carry into effect, bring to realization, realize, of sayings, promises, prophecies, to bring to pass, ratify, to fulfill, i.e. to cause God’s will (as made known in the law) to be obeyed as it should be, and God’s promises (given through the prophets) to receive fulfillment. 

Our modern dictionary has the additions of these two meanings; to satisfy and to bring to an end.   

Paul had the following to say;

Gal 5:18  But if you are led by the Spirit, you are not under the law.

So we do not have to follow the laws of God, right?

Wrong. 

God’s purpose for the law was twofold.  First it allowed all to realize certain things are required of us to experience a real relationship with Him.  But it was also given in an era, before the Holy Spirit, when man was incapable of following the law because we were slaves of sin.  This is the second reason He gave it.  It was to show us we could not keep the whole of the law.  If we could, there would have been no need for Calvary.  The intent of the law was over and done with when Jesus came

We have to follow the law of God but, it is not through the system of legalism that the enemy pushes so diligently, it is through holiness.  There is simply no place for legalism of any kind.  Grace is the order of the day.  When Paul says that if you are led by the Spirit, you are not under the law, he is saying that a true believer, one that has sold out to Jesus, listens to the Spirit inside himself, cannot break the law of God. 

Rom 8:1  There is therefore now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus.

We are slaves to sin and death no longer.  Paul says a whole lot more about the Law and Grace.  Read the book of Romans, especially through chapter eight.   I used the statement from Galatians because there is absolutely no way I can see that it can be misconstrued.  And Romans 8:1 affirms we cannot be condemned. 

Are there any rules or law for us to follow?  Yes, there certainly are.  But they are not to be understood in the enemy inspired legalistic form of keeping or memorizing a sin list.  They are not to be realized by coming up with acceptable dress or hairstyle.  There are many more ways that the enemy has corrupted these laws.  I won’t keep on here. 

The Holy Spirit is the spirit of grace and He is the only one that can tell us what God wants from us.  Listen to Him.  He is the only one that can change us.  Let Him.  He is the only one that can lead us down that narrow path.  Follow Him.    

We must stop trying to do His work, before and after, we let people in the door.  Jesus told us that the whole law was simply to love God and everybody else.  If we do this, we won’t keep breaking the law.

Love you all

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